Another day, another round... DocT was in LA today, and we played, after meeting at the Majestic Driving Range (all automated, except for your perfect shots...) where we warmed up for about 45min. After that, we met our other two players (Kevin Spacey and Mozart) at Roosevelt for 9 holes. DocT was again a joy to play with, whether good shots or bad, he kept his cool and was fun, (which I can't say regarding Wolfgang... he's a stubborn, fiery, crazy composer,) but the calm cool of Mr. Spacey was enough to balance our experience; thank God. So we had fun.

As for the round, I played well again, though opening with 2 bogey's; went on to string 5 pars together, until the dreaded 8th hole... which I dbl'd, by pulling my 4i tee-shot into the lost "and never found." It was unfortunate, because I was only +2 over at that point. Hit the 2nd tee shot solid to leave 129 yds to the flag, hit the green and 2-putted; but lost 2-strokes. Landed the 9th hole green, par-3 (165 yds) to 5-6ft, but missed the fool birdie putt. Shot +4 over. Only had 2 GIR's in the round, but scrambled well enough to stay afloat. DocT had his up's and down's, but hit many nice shots, which included a pitch in (either to save par or bogey) but was played perfectly, landed short of flag, checked up, and rolled right in. Very nice. (And DocT, now you can't tell me you can't produce spin...) My wedges helped today too.

As a funny after-note, and since I've been mentioning how my last several good rounds at Roosevelt, have been foiled by hole #8... we were sitting and having a drink outside after our round, and some other guys (the Sat. skin's group) were playing poker at another table. I heard one of them say Roosevelt was in the latest issue of Southland Golf, so I went over. The 8th hole at Roosevelt was included in the 15 most difficult holes in Los Angeles. There!! I have my proof!!! It's just plain tricky, and there's so much trouble you can get into. Today, though we were playing blue-tee's, they weren't placed back like they are for our tournaments, which is just plain wicked. So there is a devil, and he designed hole #8...

Nice round guys...sounds like DocT is giving us the business with all this "I can't spin the ball" stuff But sounds like you guys had a good time. With a 4some like that, who wouldn't have a blast. Speaking of that, so what kind of golfer was the Mozart fella?

Wade, you may have done this before, but describe the 8th hole for us in detail. Just curious.

Played yesterday, shot an indifferent 102. If it was on TV, the commentator would describe my performance as "lackluster". I can't compete in Wade's league, 4 rounds in 7 days was too much for me. No focus, I was just plumb tired. The bright spot was I hit a couple of excellent shots with the new hybrid. Since I've focused on an iron-like swing, narrower stance, and giving my swing time at the top (instead of rushing into the downswing) I've seen a huge difference. Got me onto the green twice from 165-ish out, which is what I needed.
No more golf until next Saturday. Need to recharge.

Played Cabo Real today. Course rating: 74.1 slope: 140
Was even par thru 15 holes, then went bogey, bogey, bogey for a 75. Nothing bad happened, just got tired.
Actually hit the ball better today than at any time this year. I very smoothly turned what should have been a 70 into a 75. But that's the rub o' the green isn't it?

Nice Round Bill. Very Nice.

I played 9 holes today, planned to play 18 but it was very hot and my game was quite cold so I decided to stop after 9 and hit balls at the range.

Didn't play terrible, but I'm still just a little off. Had 3 pars, a couple birdie chances that I missed, but seemed to find myself struggling to find the fairway and greens in regulation. Was mostly trying to save par with my putter. But afterwards at the range I seemed to find a groove and started stripping the ball long high and straight. Changed my swing just a bit to incorporate some setup changes from my lesson. Plan to go to the range tomorrow to see if it still works or if it was just a thing that worked with the swing I had that day. Keep you all posted.

Wade, I had fun playing with you characters. Spacey was cool. Mozart, well... And as for the Wade dude, he's ok too.

My game was unpredictable. But some tips from Spacey and Wade helped my final holes. I was trying to "muscle" all my swings, which caused a lot of ugly shots.

Wade had a great round with a lot of nice layups and putts.

But that 8th hole. Yes, I remember playing that back in April. It is an ugly hole. I can barely see the "halfway flag" (is that what that yellow and black checkered flag is called?) over on the right side beyond the hill. I drove my ball to the left, heading OB, bounced off the tree back into the fairway, and bogeyed.

At least I was able to finish the round with my only PAR. 9th hole, 165 yards downhill. Landed in the back of the green, finished with a 2-putt for par.

It's always a pleasure to play with Wade. I look forward to playing with you again, and hopefully I'll be able to tee off with my driver more than 100 yards next time.

Scott, this is a hell of a hole. In the tourney's, the tee's are back, which makes this the #1 handicap hole of all S. CA municipals. It's only a 346yd hole, but there is SO MUCH trouble. You tee from a looonng narrow area, with a short fence (and OB) to your left; and trees to your right. To have a look at the flag you must land at least 220 yds up to a hill, which will then dog-leg right down to the green. If you miss left; you're OB, if you miss right, it's either OB or face a blind shot uphill and over bushes or trees. Most people never clear the narrow escape on their tee shot... But let's say you do, and now your on top of the hill with a nice look down at the green! Miss it short left or right: sand-traps. Miss it left of green; bounce down hill to 9th fairway, and have to hit uphill through many trees. Miss it right, bushes and bushes. Go long, down the hill. It really requires an accurate approach shot, or the strokes add up quickly. When the tee's are up front, it's realistic to have a look at par, because you only need 170yds to land the dog-leg hill. That's where the tee's usually are, but never in the tournaments; always back; evil.

18 @ Harding today, simply beautiful out, high 70's (no, not my score, the weather; like you were even considering it...) Rather, it was 43/42=85. Hit some of my longer drives today, finding myself closer to the green than ever before on a few holes; and not knowing at all how to behave. No birdies tell's the story. Strung quite a few pars together, and only 1 dbl today, which really makes a difference!

Have found that the perfect lay-up yardage for me is 70 yds, because my SW half-swing seems to reliably land that distance with decent accuracy. So if I could "somehow" intentionally leave myself that yardage, I would feel rather smart. Instead, I've just been rather lucky to freguently end up 50-75 yds, and can usually leave a decent putt. Getting better also at leaving it pin-high from that distance. Now if I can just bomb the drives in the fairway, nail the approaches, land the wedges close/or 2-putt, and string the pars like a nice necklace, with a birdie or two... I'll be ready to gamble with Bill. Did I say "if" or "when?" What I meant to say was "when." Must think positive...

Wade, Wade, Wade,

Stop putting undue pressure on yourself.

You don't have to do all that to gamble with me.

I'll fade your action just as you are.

Wade; # 8 sounds like a good time to play my 7 wood to the corner of the dogleg, and then either a SW or GW down to the green. Sounds like you have to find the fairway off the tee, and that's where my 7 wood comes in handy. If you do that, it's a short wedge shot down hill to the green. Reading your post, my bet is that most golfers look at all the trouble instead of looking at the fairway. Which is how they end up in "trouble". How wide is the fairway at the corner?

You can't even see the fairway from the tee box. You tee off uphill before the dog-leg right. Past the hill is all downhill to the green.

The first half of the fairway is rather narrow. Tournament tee is far back and enclosed by the fence on the right and left. Bottleneck starts from the tee area and opens up a tad into the fairway. Top of the hill is open about 50 yards wide I think.

BTW Wade, I planned my tee shot to bounce off the left tree to get back on the fairway for a nice layup.

edit: here's a google map link to that hole:
http://maps.google.com/maps?ie=UTF8&ll=34.118944,-118.290715&spn=0.001672,0.002629&t=h&z=19&om=1

DocT,

Nice shot of the hole, but it beg's a couple of questions for you and Wade.

What's with you two? What's the big deal?
That hole looks like you could fly a 747 down the fairway.

PM me your addresses so I can send you some Brie to go with your "whine."

Wade, that sounds like a helluva hole. So as I was reading it, it sounds like one I might consider taking my medicine on and just hitting irons into. Would you be happy with a bogey on that hole? Could you (in theory, I know it's not as fun this way) hit 5I, 5I, SW and hope you one putt for par but at worst you're looking at a solid 5? Or do you really have to bomb it 220 to reach the FW? I know I'm cheating perhpas, but while whimpy, it should take a higher score out of play....

Just a thought...though I'm not sure I could stand up there and do it. I'd probably hit my 3I off the tee. But all depends on how I was swinging.

Bill, that's the last straw.


I'm sending Wade your way. You'd better watch out! If you think you can run away during his backswing, think again.


Anywho... That hole isn't my nemesis. I'm relatively too new to have a hole that I hate. I just don't like having my ball get stuck in goose dung. It's a loose impediment, but smells like... or a cigar with tobacco beetles in them. Really ruins a cigar. Or running out of Gatorade during a round, and there's no beverage cart on the course.

What were we talking about again?

I think we were talking about how you're among your own kind here on the GGR forum.

Bill, Bill, Bill,

No, maybe that hole looks like "YOU" could fly a 747 down the fairway...

Hey, wait a minute...isn't is Bill that's always giving Don grief about saying how "You" could do something? And now he's doing. Don, where are you? Paybacks!!!!

You're right!!!! I stand corrected.
I should have said, "Even Don and Scott could hit that fairway, it's big enough to land a 747." LOL

I assume you mean you can't see the fairway past the corner of the dogleg from the tee box. Going by the map and scale, it appears the fairway at the corner is about 30 or so yards wide. Hard to see where the back tee box might be, but Wade's estimate of needing 220 yards off the tee to clear the corner looks right. Going by the map, I think I'd hit my 7 wood off the tee, that's a good club for me to get out to around 220 yards. I had 223 yards to the flag last friday from the fairway, and was on the green pin high in two on a par 5, so I'm pretty sure the 7 wood would do the trick on #8. Of course, it's always easier on paper than in real life, but who's counting?

touche!

Scott, If I were to hit 5 iron, 5 iron, SW on that hole, I'd be playing that SW back to the green from way over the back. It's only 346 yards for crying out loud. How far do you hit a 5 iron? or SW?

Don't reserve a tee time until next week. It looks like it will take that much time to analyze how to play this hole.

The hole is in So. Calif., not at 5,000 ft. elevation. According to the scale it's 210 to 220 uphill off the tee. The tee shot is a 5 wood, or a 2 iron, or a 19* hybrid, then a GW or SW, then, as per Aimee, a 3 foot putt.

Unless a player is trying to protect a lead or gain on someone during the U.S. Open, why would they be concerned about missing the fairway, and play safe, to settle for a bogey or possible par?

Don, According to Wade and DocT, I thought it was all uphill. Maybe I missed that. I hit my 5I 185yards, so 2 of those would put me around the green, minus the elevation change. And Don, YOU might be over the green after 2 5I's but remember, we all don't play in the thin air of Mile High.

But if you were over the green, you'd need to SW to chip back on!

Well, The reason for the suggestion was, from the way it sounded, Wade was scoring HIGH on this hole, I think double and triple bogey. And it always seemed to be a hole that bit him. Can't miss left, OB. Can't miss right, OB. If he could hit the fairway all the time, that's one thing, but it sounded to me like he wasn't doing that on this hole very often and thus was OB.

I know it's not sexy, but I'd take a 5 or an 8 anyday.

Yes Scott, my last 3 rounds at Roosevelt, on hole #8, I have scored 7, 6, 6. The triple unfortunately came during the tourney... the tee's were back, I hit my 16* hybrid, and hooked it OB left. Bogey'd the hole w/ my 2nd tee. The last 2 times I have dbl'd this hole, and also hit my first drive OB, but shot par with my 2nd tee shots to leave me with dbl's. In answer to one of your earlier questions, "would I be ok with bogey on this hole?" The answer is yes. Happier with par. Happiest with... birdie!

More often than not, I bogey this hole, but you can see from my last 2 rounds, after going OB on my first drive both times, I still got down in 4 shots with my 2nd tee shot. Normally when the tee's are back, my strategy is to hit my 16* hybrid (which goes 220-240) and with which I normally land or fly the top hill before the dog-leg, leaving usually around 120-135 yds to the pin. And yes, from there it is a downhill shot to the green, but as I mentioned, there is trouble all around the green, so accuracy is a must.

I would say 1 of every 3-4 times, I par this hole; and have birdied it twice I believe. It's just that from the tee, even when people play a "safe" club for a layup (and you wouldn't believe how many people still pull out their driver...) the narrow view from the tee just seems to intimidate everyone, and I often see misses there from good players, mostly because of the psych-factor. To be honest, even though I say I hate this hole, I have actually come to look forward to it, simply because it's such a great challenge.

I play the 16* hybrid because my misses with it are normally left; and that's where I want to miss (if I do) on this hole. My 3w can miss right, which unless I got lucky and carried the bushes at the dog-leg... either the ball is lost in thick brush, or if I come up short, I'm left with a blind shot over bushes or through trees, to a previously mentioned "heavily guarded" green. Usually, unless I'm feeling like Tiger Woods, it requires a short punch back out to the fairway; and I hate to waste strokes like that. Scott, you said you might be in LA sometime? If so, we must play this course (and this hole) because I would love to share it with you. After all, sharing is caring...

Scott, I've played with Wade and if what you wrote above is the problem, Wade will have to play safe on every hole.