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#30666 - 04/10/09 01:19 PM Interesting thing going on now @ the Masters
srushing Offline

Vance
*****

Registered: 10/28/06
Posts: 3067
Loc: North Carolina
So Padraig had addressed a putt, then backed away. Then he was about to re-address the putt, had stepped up to take his stance and putt when he backed away. Then as he was stepping up to the putt again, the wind picked up and moved the ball.

So now the ruling...its looking like he's going to be penalized a 1 stroke penalty because AFTER he had address the putt and soled the club, it moved. Apparently even though he backed away from the putt once and had not fully re-addressed it, they are still calling it by that rule and saying he is due a penalty.

Seems wrong. I'm sure thats not what they had in mind when the rule was put in place but he had addressed it and before the stroke it moved. Seems that it doesn't technically matter that he backed off and had not re-addressed.

Too bad for Padraig.
_________________________
Golf is a game that can't be won, it can only be played - Bagger Vance

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#30668 - 04/10/09 02:01 PM Re: Interesting thing going on now @ the Masters [Re: srushing]
Bill H. Offline
Vance
****

Registered: 08/30/04
Posts: 3186
Loc: Cabo San Lucas & Deadwood, S.D...
The rule is correct. The rule states if the ball moves after the player addresses it, they are deemed to have moved it. So once it's addressed, the possiblility of a penalty exists, whether an outside agency moved it, or not.
Without the rule interpretted this way, it would be possible for a player to ground the club while addressing the ball, depressing the grass behind it, back away, thus improving the lie without danger of a penalty.
_________________________
"Act the way you want to be,
And soon you'll be the way you act."
O.E.Sage

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#30669 - 04/10/09 03:36 PM Re: Interesting thing going on now @ the Masters [Re: Bill H.]
srushing Offline

Vance
*****

Registered: 10/28/06
Posts: 3067
Loc: North Carolina
I see your point Bill, and I guess it's the best in an imperfect solution. I mean I understand the scenario you raise and it's just an unfortunate situation for Pads. He wasn't trying to improve his lie I don't think, just trying to re-asses what to do given the wind. Guess you learn never place the putter down behind the ball if you're not 100% ready to pull the trigger.
_________________________
Golf is a game that can't be won, it can only be played - Bagger Vance

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#30670 - 04/10/09 06:42 PM Re: Interesting thing going on now @ the Masters [Re: srushing]
selftaughtman Offline
Champ

Registered: 03/18/09
Posts: 172
Loc: Chester, Va
In my humble (ha! ha!) opinion...
This rule was certainly workable, wind or no wind back years ago...
Greens were hairy, grainy and etc.... Now with fast, vert fast (12 to 15 on the meter)greens, wind is now a major factor...Each tournament or golf course cuts and rolls their greens. They want their greens to be the fastest you have ever seen. Tour players are their own worst enemies, thet want the greens short and fast. Most don't want to play Bermuda greens because they are so slow. Rule may need to be changed somewhat...
But, without a doubt Padraig addressed the ball and then backed away...
The correct call was made....

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#30671 - 04/11/09 02:13 AM Re: Interesting thing going on now @ the Masters [Re: selftaughtman]
Bill H. Offline
Vance
****

Registered: 08/30/04
Posts: 3186
Loc: Cabo San Lucas & Deadwood, S.D...

selftaught, if a player addresses their ball and backs away in a strong wind, on a green where the ball has a chance of moving, they should mark their ball and start over. Then make sure, after placing, the ball is at rest before they, again, address it.
Padraig Harrington was hit with a strong, sudden, wind gust just as he addressed the ball, which very seldom happens. The rules are set to cover most situations on the golf course, but no matter what the rule, there will always be situations that are a deviation of the norm.
I don't know why I went into this long explanation, but the bottom line is, there shouldn't be any reason to change the rule. It was actually designed for players protection.
If you get a chance, look through the U.S.G.A. decision book. It shows situations that were not covered by the rule book. It's about 9 inches thick.
_________________________
"Act the way you want to be,
And soon you'll be the way you act."
O.E.Sage

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#30674 - 04/11/09 05:32 AM Re: Interesting thing going on now @ the Masters [Re: Bill H.]
DON Offline

Vance
*****

Registered: 05/04/05
Posts: 4888
Loc: Aurora, Colorado
I understand the rule, and I agree they were correct in giving out the penality. BUT, I still think it's a rule that in this case penalized a player for nothing more than an act of nature. He wasn't trying to cheat or get away with anything, it was just a gust of wind and he got screwed.
_________________________
Putting is easy, IF you have the right putter.
Later, Don.

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#30676 - 04/11/09 06:29 AM Re: Interesting thing going on now @ the Masters [Re: DON]
Bill H. Offline
Vance
****

Registered: 08/30/04
Posts: 3186
Loc: Cabo San Lucas & Deadwood, S.D...
Originally Posted By: DON
I understand the rule, and I agree they were correct in giving out the penality. BUT, I still think it's a rule that in this case penalized a player for nothing more than an act of nature. He wasn't trying to cheat or get away with anything, it was just a gust of wind and he got screwed.


You all are not getting the point................The player is not a victim, the player is a volunteer............He addressed the ball, the wind was blowing and he stepped away from the ball. If he wanted to protect himself from your "act of nature" he should have marked his ball and started over.
Anytime you play in high wind, if you address your ball on the putting green and step away from it, you should mark it, replace it, make sure it's not going to move and you can address your ball again. Especially if the wind is blowing with the grain or you're on a downhill slope, or both.

My hope for all of you is you can understand............Real golfers don't cry "unfair" or want to "change the rule" when a decision isn't in their favor.
I know you get it because all those pansy hacker complainers who scream "unfair" when they don't agree with a ruling are all on another forum, aren't they? smile
_________________________
"Act the way you want to be,
And soon you'll be the way you act."
O.E.Sage

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#30677 - 04/11/09 07:34 AM Re: Interesting thing going on now @ the Masters [Re: Bill H.]
srushing Offline

Vance
*****

Registered: 10/28/06
Posts: 3067
Loc: North Carolina
So if backing away from the ball doesn't reset the play, why does marking the ball reset the play? Is there an official rule that spells out that marking the ball is a complete reset and anything that happened up to that point is forgotten?

With Bill's help I understand better now that there was more Pads could have done to protect himself, and by the rule he was in error. But it's unfortunate because he didn't attempt to improve his lie or gain an advantage in his actions. But maybe he didn't know about the marking-ball-reset either smile
_________________________
Golf is a game that can't be won, it can only be played - Bagger Vance

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#30679 - 04/11/09 08:07 AM Re: Interesting thing going on now @ the Masters [Re: srushing]
Bill H. Offline
Vance
****

Registered: 08/30/04
Posts: 3186
Loc: Cabo San Lucas & Deadwood, S.D...
Originally Posted By: srushing
So if backing away from the ball doesn't reset the play, why does marking the ball reset the play?


It's not a case of resetting the play, it's a case of resetting the ball. When you mark the ball and pick it up, the ball isn't in play until you place it and pick up your marker.

Most of the players would have done the same thing Padraig did. There probably aren't 2 percent of the players out there that would have marked their ball after they addressed it. I bet Padraig will pay more attention from now on. We may watch and play golf for the rest of our lives and not see that happen again.
The main thing us golfers want to understand, knowing the rules will save more strokes than it will cost.
_________________________
"Act the way you want to be,
And soon you'll be the way you act."
O.E.Sage

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#30680 - 04/11/09 08:10 AM Re: Interesting thing going on now @ the Masters [Re: srushing]
Bill H. Offline
Vance
****

Registered: 08/30/04
Posts: 3186
Loc: Cabo San Lucas & Deadwood, S.D...
Originally Posted By: srushing
Is there an official rule that spells out that marking the ball is a complete reset and anything that happened up to that point is forgotten?


To my knowledge, it's not spelled out in the rule book, but it should be in the decision book.
_________________________
"Act the way you want to be,
And soon you'll be the way you act."
O.E.Sage

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#30696 - 04/12/09 07:54 AM Re: Interesting thing going on now @ the Masters [Re: Bill H.]
DON Offline

Vance
*****

Registered: 05/04/05
Posts: 4888
Loc: Aurora, Colorado
I still don't like him getting a penality due to the wind blowing his ball when he wasn't even standing over it at the time. Rule or not, it just deesn't seem right.
_________________________
Putting is easy, IF you have the right putter.
Later, Don.

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#30697 - 04/12/09 07:57 AM Re: Interesting thing going on now @ the Masters [Re: DON]
Bill H. Offline
Vance
****

Registered: 08/30/04
Posts: 3186
Loc: Cabo San Lucas & Deadwood, S.D...
Originally Posted By: DON
I still don't like him getting a penality due to the wind blowing his ball when he wasn't even standing over it at the time. Rule or not, it just deesn't seem right.


Don,
I'll send Brie unless you have another preference. smile
_________________________
"Act the way you want to be,
And soon you'll be the way you act."
O.E.Sage

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#30721 - 04/13/09 07:34 AM Re: Interesting thing going on now @ the Masters [Re: Bill H.]
DON Offline

Vance
*****

Registered: 05/04/05
Posts: 4888
Loc: Aurora, Colorado
No need to send anything. Just voiceing my opinion.
_________________________
Putting is easy, IF you have the right putter.
Later, Don.

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#30731 - 04/13/09 08:27 AM Re: Interesting thing going on now @ the Masters [Re: DON]
Bill H. Offline
Vance
****

Registered: 08/30/04
Posts: 3186
Loc: Cabo San Lucas & Deadwood, S.D...

It is true........Once in awhile the rules are out of balance and don't seem equitable.
_________________________
"Act the way you want to be,
And soon you'll be the way you act."
O.E.Sage

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