Feel free to complete it. They offer a giveaway prize.

http://duke.qualtrics.com/SE/?SID=SV_03xSG2avzQbmmHi&SVID=Prod

I took the survey 2 days ago, so I'm entered already.

Cool.. Hard for me to believe that they'll get a lot of people saying they lie and cheat during their league championship. I mean if they cheat during the event do you think they'd tell the truth about it? But maybe some people don't realize it's cheating...

Took it..entertaining.

I'll be interested to see the results.. I hope they break them down by the various parameters also - work, state, religion, age, employment status, etc. Will be interesting to see how results change by social category...

So from what I understand, they have at least 3 versions of the survey. Mine said the situation was the Club Championship so every question was set into that setting. So ofcourse I played by the rules as I would in real life in a real event. But apparently there are also version for a Company event and a Social/Casual outing. Did you guys get one of those?

I think they goofed. I think it would have been better to ask everyone sections from each set of conditions, to see how we might answer differently as the situation changed. I definitely in a social/casual round might have answered some of the questions differently.

My survey was for the group of 4 friends playing a fun round of golf. And that's completely different than playing in any type of competition. Playing a practice round is also different than if you are playing to build a handicap. I also found some of the questions didn't really apply. I think you really need to ask one question for all of this when playing just a simple round of golf. If you don't use the score for your handicap, and you aren't playing for money or pride of beating your friends, just working on improveing your game. IS IT CHEATING IF YOU DON'T FOLLOW ALL THE RULES TO THE LETTER?

One question was would you can a penality on yourself for grounding your club in a hazard. First off, I've never done that, not on purpose or my accident. If I was playing in competition of some kind, then sure I'd call the penality. But if I'm working on my game and wanted to check where my club entered the sand in the bunker, I might mark the sand with my club so I have a way of knowing exactly where I made contact with the sand. That's a very good drill to use when practicing your bunker game, and it might be good to do it now and then during a round to see how you take your game from the practice area to the course. Again, I've never done this, but I wouldn't call it cheating if someone did it during a practice round. It's not cheating if no one is being cheated in my opinion.

Don, again you bring forth some interesting thoughts. Even though I am not a 'serious' golfer by tradition,(aren't we supposed to be having some fun) I do attempt to follow the rules to the best of my knowledge. While taking the 'test' the only crime I found I commit is asking waht club is someone using on a particular shot. I was not even aware of this rule and for the most part do not adhere to it.

I ask quite frequently what club someone else used to play the hole, so I am guilty of that as well. Don, great question you pose really. I've gone out to play a round by myself on a Sunday afternoon and have occasionally played two balls as well on certain shots that I may need improvement on, such as a bunker, but only if no one was playing up behind me. These scores never get recorded on counted towards handicap, so personally I'm pretty comfortable with that. For me (at least I like think), that golf is between me and the course, not me and the others, so I normally am harder on myself for that reason because I want a true indication of what my score is for my own personal reasons.

One thing I am horrible about though, and perhaps this is due to having a wandering mind on the course (or early onset of altzheimer's), is occasionally forgetting every stroke I played on a hole. It's pretty embarrassing when I do, especially when playing with others, but seriously there is no ill attempt at a lower score here, I simply forget sometimes. I get in la-la-land sometimes when I'm out there, as golf is very therapeutic to me, so it's almost as if I'm playing and thinking about something else. Wierd, but then again, that's just me.

Well as I recall an old story with Ben Hogan playing in a 4some, and as the others were discussing the specific rules of the match (mulligans, etc), Ben replied: "Well, we can play Golf or we can play some other game..."

So yeah, to Don's point, we are supposed to play by the rules but as said, if I'm out one a practice round or some social rounds, sure, I'll take liberties that I don't take in a serious or competitive round. Re-hitting a chip or pitch shot, etc. Maybe asking a buddy what he hit on the Par 3. Something like that. But that is completely different than a serious round. Then I follow the rules to the best of my ability

YES IT'S CHEATING!

If you call it a practice round, or a round with your buddies and you don't post a score, you are "SANDBAGGING" your handicap. Those rounds will better your play, which means you are making yourself a better player than your handicap would suggest.

This weekend, let's all drive on the left side of the freeway. We're not on our way to work, so why follow the rules of the road?

REFER TO ABOVE POST

Practice is for the practice range.
A round of golf is a round of golf. Once you sign up for a handicap, every round is "official".

Scott, I can't believe you don't follow the rules each time you play ANY round of golf. You also are a "SANDBAGGER"

REFER TO ABOVE POSTS

THANK YOU AIMEE................

Aimee; since I DON'T have an offical USGA handicap, NONE of my scores count for anything other than what I want them to be. As for "Sandbagging" If I don't have a handicap, how can I be sandbagging?

And if practice is for the practice range, Are the pros on Tour Cheating when they play a "PRACTICE ROUND" on Wednesdays before the start of the event? They are practicing on the exact same course they will be competing on the next 4 days. They can hit as many balls as they have time for from the same place to see
what shot works best for them. Is that also Cheating?

Bill makes a very good point about playing a round makes a golfer a better golfer than his handicap would suggest. But going to the practice range and working on your short game will do the same thing. And I doubt anyone would can practiceing for 4 hours a day "Cheating". If it is, then Tiger is one of the biggest cheater ever. He practices for 10 to 12 hours a day.

As for not turning in a BAD score and that isn't right as that would make one's handicap too high, that's not really true. Fact is your handicap is based on the TOP 10 scores for the last 20 rounds. So you could post a score of 150 and it wouldn't effect your score one bit. That 150 score would just get thrown out, and have no effect on anything.

Don, I wasn't saying you were a cheater for practicing on the course. I said that if you keep a handicap (as an amateur) you have to count every round you play as an official round.
I think the concept of the practice round for the pro's is that they may have never played that course so it gives them and their caddy an opportunity to better understand the layout, which gives all players a fair chance at playing the course well.
There are different rules for pros than amateurs, that's why they get paid to play well.
A practice range is for the sole purpose of practice. Just like the baseball players take batting practice to sharpen their swing.
If you want to keep a legitimate handicap, you have to turn in all scores because it shows all the rounds you have played. If you turn in one score in May, don't post any thru June or July, then play a tournement in August and blow out the field, you are going to be in trouble. By the same token, I played one round with a guy who was going to be in a tournement who played up one set of tees (white instead of blue) because he wanted to make sure his handicap stayed higher...which is sort of cheating, wouldn't you agree?
The scores that are used for your GHIN are based on the 10 scores with the lowest handicap differentials. So if you shoot a higher score than usual but it is at a course with a higher slope rating, it could be counted.

If I may, I would like to ask a question.......If a golfer (let's call them that for right now) plays golf, on a golf course, and doesn't follow the rules and etiquette each time they play, are they showing disrespect for the game, past, present and future?

I don't know guys. While I can appreciate your opinion, I'm hoping to get my game to the point where I can sign up to track a USGA handicap, but to get there I need to do more work in real situations on the course, and you just can't get that at the range. So in my opinion, I'm going to take the opportunity when I have it to practice those things I don't do well. When I play with others, or in the occasional outing, I certainly play by the rules so in my opinion there are times on the golf course when you are playing, and when you are practicing.

That sums it up nicely for me.

Like Ben said, "we can play golf or we can play some other game...". So I think I'll call my game, Scott's Game Similar to Golf, or SGSTG for short. See I sometimes play a game called HORSE, with a basketball and a goal. Same gear as the game BASKETBALL but different. is it cheating? nope...just a different game. So from now on, I'm going to play SGSTG instead of golf. That way I can practice when I want too.


I think people pay their greens fees, they can do what they want. If I'm playing you for something other than just the fun of being out there, we'll play by all the rules. But if we're out for fun and you skull a chip and want to try that again, I won't turn you in to the Marshals. Quick putt that 'gimmie distance' putt and miss, you can record it however you want too.

Or maybe I'll turn pro...Pros do practice rounds all the time. Then I can hit as many shots as I want during my practice rounds.

Sandbagging to me includes the intent to gain an unfair advantage over the competition over inflating your handicap...hard for me to over inflate a 3.5 very much . I don't post practice round scores to my handicap. If I did, I'd actually be increasing my handicap because I'd get more penalty shots added to my score since I was re-hitting shots

Hey all,
I'm just asking a question and causing a little controversy. I also hit extra balls and don't follow the rules when I'm alone on the golf course. The cool thing is my practice rounds are very good and my scoring rounds are terrible. But then, my 12.4 handicap index shows that.

Maybe it should be 1.5

I'm back to getting a lot of strokes from you again.

Bill, that's one of the reasons this is so much fun, keep it up, otherwise we'd all get bored, haha..

just stirring the pot, eh?

Aimee; If this person you mentioned, plays from a forward tee, then he should use the lower rating and slope for that set of tees, And if he doesn't, he would more likely LOWER his handicap, and only be cheating himself, not you or those he'll be playing against. IF he did this often, his handicap would be a good bit lower than what it should be, and he'd never be able to beat his competition.

I would agree if someone has an intent to make their handicap higher, or keep it higher by playing a harder course, different tees, etc, that to me is sandbagging. It's amazing to me how people can want to WIN so bad that they are willing to cheat. I know people who blatantly cheat during the round. It's sad. How can it feel good winning something knowing you were not playing on a level playing field? Sort of like pro athletes taking steroids to gain an advantage.

I guess I use the NY Times Rule...if you wouldn't want what you're doing to wind up on the front page of the NY Times, don't do it!

So true, a game which is about self-reporting penalties and scores...if you have to fiddle around with it to make yourself satisfied, what's the point. Like the so-called "vanity caps"...the people who say they have lower handicap than they really should so they look better to others (or actually more so to feed their ego).

I think the point can be made that for all of us who are striving to improve, we are always practicing. And trying to learn. Maybe it comes down to a personal philosophy, that you go out with the intent of using a round simply for working on technique and "practicing" without any real intent of keeping score.

I don't play golf to beat anyone. I play golf to have fun. If my goal is the win or beat anything, it would be to BEAT the course, not my playing partners. I'd rather lose while playing well, then win while playing poorly.

I like to:
1. Follow the rules while on the course.
2. Post all of my scores.
3. Say good bye to someone who cheats or throws clubs.
4. Never play a second time with negative people.
5. Never play with people who swear more then I do.
6. Beat whoever I'm playing with.
7. Still remember, "It's only a game."
8. Play golf with a caddy or ride in a golf cart.

This has been a learning experience for me, since I play with the same people most of the time. I would say that most (90%) of us play by the rules all the time. Bill is right it is sandbagging and not fair to anyone. Golf is a game and some of us take it much more seriously than others and that is probibly the truth of the matter.

I liked the survey it made me think. I had the survey where you are playing in a foursome and the questions are about not keeping score correctly and my opinion in percentage of people that would do that. We will have to talk more when the results are in.

some of us already do!

OK Kev,
Where are you really from???
Excluding John Cleese and the late Benny Hill, no one in the UK has a sense of humor!

and with that you have just destroyed all you have built between the UK and USA.
We have humour over here just normally called sarcasm! - you may have seen a few comedians from our great shores wonder over to your side - Hugh laurie (House), eddie izzard (the riches) just to name but a few...
There is a reason why your country drives on the wrong side (http://www.2pass.co.uk/goodluck.htm) as you wanted to distance yourself from your previous 'owners'

but Benny Hill was cool!! - something about a fat bloke being chased by skinny ladies in underwear has my vote everytime!!!

Kevboy, when I saw Bill's post, I was gonna mention Eddie Izzard. He is hilarious.

Oh, and I would add all of Monty Python, not just John Cleese.

Well Kev, it looks like you might have some supporters and British humor fans over here.....at least Klun.......Let's get together, have a tea party and play some golf.

who's bringing the crumpets?

Or you could do the Spanish version of the tea party with the mayonase instead of tea.

Bill is such a chain yanker, isn't he? Not that that rhymes with any common UK moniker for him. Bremner Bird and Fortune, Between Iraq and a Hard Place. It's out on YouTube. Hilarious.